Thanks, Vanguard, for your suggestions.

I added your "report-type=delivery-status" rule. It behaves the same way as
my rule that checks for "Mail delivery failed" in the subject line. The
emails that are bounce messages are ending up in my Junk folder rather than
the spoofed folder that the rule calls for. This means that the rule is not
being applied when the message is received.

Manually applying the rule to the messages in the Junk folder behaves
properly: the messages are detected and moved to my spoofed folder.

So my problem remains: Even though I have "No automatic filtering" selected
(under Junk Mail Options), and even though these emails are from "System
Administrator" (which is not part of or allowed to be part of my "Blocked
Senders List") Outlook is moving these mails to the Junk folder.

Any other thoughts?

"VanguardLH" wrote in message
...
"Tom" wrote in message
...
The only rule I have is:

Apply this rule after the message arrives
with 'undelivered' or
'Mail delivery failed' or
'Mail delivery failure' or
"FAILURE NOTICE' or
'Returned mail' or
'Undelivered:' or
'(Failure)' or
'Returned to Sender' or
'Undeliverable:' or
'undeliverable' or
'warning:' or
'Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients' or
'Undeliverable'
move it to the Spoofed folder


Wrong rule. Use the following which detects if it is a *valid* NDR
(non-delivery report) by checking for the header.

Apply this rule after the message arrives
with "report-type=delivery-status" in the message header
and move it to the Junk folder (or wherever you want)
and stop processing more rules

You neglected to include the stop-clause. You are also attempting to
trigger on the various comments that a mail server *might* insert in the
body to denote the cause of the NDR. Trigger on the header.

"Tom" wrote in message ...
Even though I have "No automatic filtering" selected ...

Set Outlook's junk filtering to "no automatic filtering". Then exit
Outlook. Make sure that no outlook.exe remains running in the
Processes tab in Task Manager. Load a new instance of Outlook. Then
check if that junk option remained set the way you wanted. I've seen
some users claim that the setting sticks but after a couple hours has
been reset to Low.

Hi, Vanguard,

Okay, I think (with your help) I've narrowed it down. (This almost deserves
a new thread!)

Outlook, even with "No automatic filtering" selected and NO rules at all, is
moving some items to the Junk E-mail box. (This is after a re-boot and
confirmation that these settings stuck.)

It seems to me that this is a bug. AND, this behavior seems to have
priority and is apparently interfering with rules that I write.

Darn.

Any final suggestions other than to get in the car and drive across the lake
to Bill Gates' house and ask him to give me back the several hours of my
time this has wasted?! :-)

PS He lives in an somewhat more upscale neighborhood than I do!

"Tom" wrote in message ...
Hi, Vanguard,

Okay, I think (with your help) I've narrowed it down. (This almost
deserves a new thread!)

Outlook, even with "No automatic filtering" selected and NO rules at
all, is moving some items to the Junk E-mail box. (This is after a
re-boot and confirmation that these settings stuck.)

It seems to me that this is a bug. AND, this behavior seems to have
priority and is apparently interfering with rules that I write.


Have you yet tried to load Outlook in its safe mode ("outlook.exe
/safe") which will NOT load any plug-ins installed for Outlook? Maybe
your antivirus program's plug-in is being too intrusive. If that
fails to get rid of the problematic behavior then I'd try using
msconfig (or SysInternals AutoRuns) to disable all startup items,
reboot, and test again, or even try rebooting into Windows' Safe Mode
(with networking).

Great suggestion, Vanguard! I ran Outlook with /SAFE and unfortunately, it
appears that Outlook is ignoring the "no automatic filtering" selection in
the Junk email options window.

When the first spam arrived, I got this pop-up:

"Outlook has downloaded a message that appears to be junk email. This
message was automatically moved to the junk folder."

So, now I'm at my wit's end. It seems that there is no way to tell Outlook
not to apply its own spam filtering rules. And, in fact, I DO want it to
apply its rules... but only after my rules are applied.

Have you sny further thoughts?

"Tom" wrote in message ...
Great suggestion, Vanguard! I ran Outlook with /SAFE and
unfortunately, it appears that Outlook is ignoring the "no automatic
filtering" selection in the Junk email options window.

When the first spam arrived, I got this pop-up:

"Outlook has downloaded a message that appears to be junk email.
This message was automatically moved to the junk folder."

So, now I'm at my wit's end. It seems that there is no way to tell
Outlook not to apply its own spam filtering rules. And, in fact, I
DO want it to apply its rules... but only after my rules are
applied.

Have you sny further thoughts?


I'm out. Unless maybe you are in a domain and a GPO is getting pushed
to your host. However, although the policy gets foisted onto your
host, I thought that was only during login. Sounded like you had
logged in and then changed the junk filter which means that setting
should stick during the rest of your current Windows session. If the
IT folks don't know about some trick they used to enforce junk
filtering (I recall something to do with Office policies but never got
into them or got afflicted with them to then figure out how to
circumvent them), I'd try doing a repair (under the Help menu in
OL2002 - you'll probably need the install CD, a network install path,
or the subdir left behind called, I think, c:\msoffice or something
like that, where the cab files were stored to perform later
customizations of the install) or do an uninstall and reinstall.

In fact, a trick I use to get around some policies (those that effect
registry changes), is to simply put a "regedit /s regfile" event in
Task Scheduler to run on login (or I could use a shortcut in the
Startup group under the Start menu). For example, some companies
enforce a scree saver timer of 15 minutes but on a shared host this
resulted in having to divulge the login password to too many users in
case the password-protected (another GPO setting) screen saver got
activated, or someone with the password had to be found and go visit
the shared host. So the GPO got pushed during login, we weren't
logging off (to login again), GPOs are effected only during login, so
they pushed their policy when we started the host but then we (with
admin privs) would change the registry to what we wanted. Wouldn't
work unless we had admin rights (on the domain to that host), in
Development of Software QA we always had to have those privileges. We
couldn't get them to have different policies for our hosts (i.e., it
was a company-wide policy to which they allowed no exceptions). We
told them what we planned to do and they okayed it so it was a way for
us to modify the policies for our hosts and with permission.

Final outcome:

I spoke with our IT department. Our Exchange server's rules were be applied
before my local rules. That explains the behavior I was seeing.

Sorry to have taken your time so needlessly.

I appreciate, Vanguard, your efforts to help.

Tom