Hey Bruce,
What's the word regarding the future of the
OE NG when MS pulls the plug on its
msnews server? Does MS intend to issue
a rmgroup across the entire Usenet to
bag all the Microsoft.Public.* NG's?
Bill

MS is not going to do anything to save current NGs AFAIK. Some servers may
keep them. Google will have posts for years. As far as asking questions
about OE, this is the place to be getting used to.

XP - Networking, Mail And Getting Online Forum
http://social.answers.microsoft.com/...etwork/threads
--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP [Mail]
Imperial Beach, CA


"Bill" wrote in message
...
Hey Bruce,
What's the word regarding the future of the
OE NG when MS pulls the plug on its
msnews server? Does MS intend to issue
a rmgroup across the entire Usenet to
bag all the Microsoft.Public.* NG's?
Bill

Bill wrote:

What's the word regarding the future of the OE NG when MS pulls the
plug on its msnews server? Does MS intend to issue a rmgroup across
the entire Usenet to bag all the Microsoft.Public.* NG's?

No, I'm not Bruce.

Giganews says it will continue carrying the microsoft.* newsgroups.
Google Groups is unlikely to drop them. My NSP (Albasani) says they
will ignore any 'rmgroup' commands issued by Julien Elie or any other
self-appointed egotistical Usenet admin.

Microsoft is dropping their NNTP server (and thereby any peering to it).
Microsoft is not the Usenet, a worldwide mesh network of NNTP servers
over which Microsoft has no control (and partially the reason why they
are retreating to web-based forums). So you will lose the availability
of Microsoft's NNTP server to get at their pretend forums (aka
Communities) via their webnews-for-dummies gateway. Start looking
around for another NSP since they are likely to continue carrying the
microsoft.* newsgroups.

I'm currently doing that now with a NNTP server
other than msnews. Hopefully, MS will keep its
hands off of the existing NGs.

Most of the online forums I've tried don't fair very
well against OE's news reader, both from the point
of view of navigation and watched thread alerts.

Bill


"VanguardLH" wrote in message
...
Bill wrote:

What's the word regarding the future of the OE NG when MS pulls the
plug on its msnews server? Does MS intend to issue a rmgroup across
the entire Usenet to bag all the Microsoft.Public.* NG's?

No, I'm not Bruce.

Giganews says it will continue carrying the microsoft.* newsgroups.
Google Groups is unlikely to drop them. My NSP (Albasani) says they
will ignore any 'rmgroup' commands issued by Julien Elie or any other
self-appointed egotistical Usenet admin.

Microsoft is dropping their NNTP server (and thereby any peering to it).
Microsoft is not the Usenet, a worldwide mesh network of NNTP servers
over which Microsoft has no control (and partially the reason why they
are retreating to web-based forums). So you will lose the availability
of Microsoft's NNTP server to get at their pretend forums (aka
Communities) via their webnews-for-dummies gateway. Start looking
around for another NSP since they are likely to continue carrying the
microsoft.* newsgroups.

Bill wrote:

I'm currently doing that now with a NNTP server other than msnews.

I mentioned using a non-Microsoft NSP because you posted using
Microsoft's NNTP server in your first post.

Hopefully, MS will keep its hands off of the existing NGs.

Microsoft has no control over Usenet (and why they are leaving), not
even a legal means to extinct the microsoft.* newsgroups regarding
trademark or copyright infringment since no one needs permission to
mention Microsoft's company or product names to discuss them in books,
news articles, or forums or newsgroups. They just have to not pretend
they are Microsoft (something that some of the leeching web-based forums
should better clarify). The newsgroups will continue to exist at the
discretion of whomever actually owns the resources and property that
operate the NSP services. Microsoft can only enforce and kill their own
services.

This isn't something new to NSPs. They have had to fend off rogue
control messages for decades. An NSP isn't going to drop any group
unless they choose so, not even if they cannot peer the group. That
Microsoft is dropping their NNTP server means current NSPs using
Microsoft as their primary peering host will have to change their
peering relationships. Those that never peered direct from Microsoft's
NNTP server don't care since nothing changes for them.

Most of the online forums I've tried don't fair very well against OE's
news reader, both from the point of view of navigation and watched
thread alerts.

I haven't found a web-based forum yet that can compete with the features
available in a newsreader connecting to an NNTP server. That's why most
of those leech sites pretend to operate forums but are instead providing
a webnews-for-boobs gateway to Usenet.

Thanks for the clarifications. We'll all have to wait for awhile to see
how things pan out on the non-MS NNTP servers. Hopefully,
Earthlink hasn't been peering from Microsoft's server.
Bill


"VanguardLH" wrote in message
...
Bill wrote:

I'm currently doing that now with a NNTP server other than msnews.

I mentioned using a non-Microsoft NSP because you posted using
Microsoft's NNTP server in your first post.

Hopefully, MS will keep its hands off of the existing NGs.

Microsoft has no control over Usenet (and why they are leaving), not
even a legal means to extinct the microsoft.* newsgroups regarding
trademark or copyright infringment since no one needs permission to
mention Microsoft's company or product names to discuss them in books,
news articles, or forums or newsgroups. They just have to not pretend
they are Microsoft (something that some of the leeching web-based forums
should better clarify). The newsgroups will continue to exist at the
discretion of whomever actually owns the resources and property that
operate the NSP services. Microsoft can only enforce and kill their own
services.

This isn't something new to NSPs. They have had to fend off rogue
control messages for decades. An NSP isn't going to drop any group
unless they choose so, not even if they cannot peer the group. That
Microsoft is dropping their NNTP server means current NSPs using
Microsoft as their primary peering host will have to change their
peering relationships. Those that never peered direct from Microsoft's
NNTP server don't care since nothing changes for them.

Most of the online forums I've tried don't fair very well against OE's
news reader, both from the point of view of navigation and watched
thread alerts.

I haven't found a web-based forum yet that can compete with the features
available in a newsreader connecting to an NNTP server. That's why most
of those leech sites pretend to operate forums but are instead providing
a webnews-for-boobs gateway to Usenet.

Bill wrote:

Thanks for the clarifications. We'll all have to wait for awhile to see
how things pan out on the non-MS NNTP servers. Hopefully,
Earthlink hasn't been peering from Microsoft's server.

You could probably ask them as to what are their intentions regarding
Microsoft's scrambling away from Usenet. Find out from them if they
will continue carrying the microsoft.public.* newsgroups and if they
currently peer from Microsoft's NNTP server. I wouldn't think that they
would hide their intentions.

One user of Giganews wanted to know, was suggested that he actually ask
Giganews, and reported back that Giganews stated they will continue
carrying the microsoft.* groups. I doubt Google gives a gnat's fart
about Microsoft leaving Usenet other than of having to change their
peering relationships (if they peered from Microsoft). My NSP says they
will continue carrying those newsgroups and will ignore any rmgroup
control messages from Julien Elie or any other rogue source attempting
to issue non-authorized control messages.

Just ask Earthlink to see what they say. I have never used any of
Earthlink's services to know how responsive is their tech support or
even if their reps are given prior knowledge of planned changes in
Earthlink's services.

Bill wrote:

Thanks for the clarifications. We'll all have to wait for awhile to see
how things pan out on the non-MS NNTP servers. Hopefully,
Earthlink hasn't been peering from Microsoft's server.

You could probably ask them as to what are their intentions regarding
Microsoft's scrambling away from Usenet. Find out from them if they
will continue carrying the microsoft.public.* newsgroups and if they
currently peer from Microsoft's NNTP server. I wouldn't think that they
would hide their intentions.

One user of Giganews wanted to know, was suggested that he actually ask
Giganews, and reported back that Giganews stated they will continue
carrying the microsoft.* groups. I doubt Google gives a gnat's fart
about Microsoft leaving Usenet other than of having to change their
peering relationships (if they peered from Microsoft). My NSP says they
will continue carrying those newsgroups and will ignore any rmgroup
control messages from Julien Elie or any other rogue source attempting
to issue non-authorized control messages.

Just ask Earthlink to see what they say. I have never used any of
Earthlink's services to know how responsive is their tech support or
even if their reps are given prior knowledge of planned changes in
Earthlink's services.

Thanks for the clarifications. We'll all have to wait for awhile to see
how things pan out on the non-MS NNTP servers. Hopefully,
Earthlink hasn't been peering from Microsoft's server.
Bill


"VanguardLH" wrote in message
...
Bill wrote:

I'm currently doing that now with a NNTP server other than msnews.

I mentioned using a non-Microsoft NSP because you posted using
Microsoft's NNTP server in your first post.

Hopefully, MS will keep its hands off of the existing NGs.

Microsoft has no control over Usenet (and why they are leaving), not
even a legal means to extinct the microsoft.* newsgroups regarding
trademark or copyright infringment since no one needs permission to
mention Microsoft's company or product names to discuss them in books,
news articles, or forums or newsgroups. They just have to not pretend
they are Microsoft (something that some of the leeching web-based forums
should better clarify). The newsgroups will continue to exist at the
discretion of whomever actually owns the resources and property that
operate the NSP services. Microsoft can only enforce and kill their own
services.

This isn't something new to NSPs. They have had to fend off rogue
control messages for decades. An NSP isn't going to drop any group
unless they choose so, not even if they cannot peer the group. That
Microsoft is dropping their NNTP server means current NSPs using
Microsoft as their primary peering host will have to change their
peering relationships. Those that never peered direct from Microsoft's
NNTP server don't care since nothing changes for them.

Most of the online forums I've tried don't fair very well against OE's
news reader, both from the point of view of navigation and watched
thread alerts.

I haven't found a web-based forum yet that can compete with the features
available in a newsreader connecting to an NNTP server. That's why most
of those leech sites pretend to operate forums but are instead providing
a webnews-for-boobs gateway to Usenet.

Bill wrote:

I'm currently doing that now with a NNTP server other than msnews.

I mentioned using a non-Microsoft NSP because you posted using
Microsoft's NNTP server in your first post.

Hopefully, MS will keep its hands off of the existing NGs.

Microsoft has no control over Usenet (and why they are leaving), not
even a legal means to extinct the microsoft.* newsgroups regarding
trademark or copyright infringment since no one needs permission to
mention Microsoft's company or product names to discuss them in books,
news articles, or forums or newsgroups. They just have to not pretend
they are Microsoft (something that some of the leeching web-based forums
should better clarify). The newsgroups will continue to exist at the
discretion of whomever actually owns the resources and property that
operate the NSP services. Microsoft can only enforce and kill their own
services.

This isn't something new to NSPs. They have had to fend off rogue
control messages for decades. An NSP isn't going to drop any group
unless they choose so, not even if they cannot peer the group. That
Microsoft is dropping their NNTP server means current NSPs using
Microsoft as their primary peering host will have to change their
peering relationships. Those that never peered direct from Microsoft's
NNTP server don't care since nothing changes for them.

Most of the online forums I've tried don't fair very well against OE's
news reader, both from the point of view of navigation and watched
thread alerts.

I haven't found a web-based forum yet that can compete with the features
available in a newsreader connecting to an NNTP server. That's why most
of those leech sites pretend to operate forums but are instead providing
a webnews-for-boobs gateway to Usenet.